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stan
Gay Rights Activist
Joined: 07 Apr 2004
Posts: 1268
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Sun Jan 09, 2005 5:59 am |
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As some of you may know ive recently bought another F7R for my N reg Clio 16v. After a nice trek accross the south of England (Swansea to Essex), the engine was picked up and brought to my workshop in the back of the Clio, along with the gearbox etc etc!!
The popular conversion seems to be to use the bottom end from this engine with the existing F7P 1.8 head. As many of you know, the Megane head is of better design to yield more torque. Going on this, my plan is to fit the engine as a complete unit rather than just the bottom end, and running 34.6mm inlet valves from a Pug Mi16. Along with my piper cams i reckon there should be a nice gain!
The main reason that people dont use the Megane head is because it uses DIS management. A couple of other little problems have to be over come, such as the idle speed control valve and possibly the throttle pot, as in they are a different arrangement on the Megane. These have already been overcome, and will be explained when i get piccies up in the next couple of days. Apart from that, the original 1.8 managment can be retained. It was also suggested that the inlet manifold from the Meg is larger and so MAY not fit in the limited Clio engine bay. After comparison between manifolds, i reckon it will fit as it doesnt protrude anyfurther than the Clio manifold, and it is smaller in most other geometrical respects. Again piccies will show what im on about!
As for the distributer, the head requires machining to accept the boss. By this i mean wher the end of the camshaft sits (ex cam), the lower radius on the end of the head needs to be increased to match that of the cam carrier. I plan on using the die grinder and appropriate bit to increase this radius. This may sound a bit of a "butcher" type approach, but so long as i get it as near as poss, it will be ok, as the oil pressure in the head is minimal, and its nothing a bit of RTV wont sort out!!
So far ive stripped the engines ancillaries, removed the head, and removed the sump. everything looks in very good order, and as soon as i can get it on my engine stand, a full strip/clean will commence!
Like i said, piccies will be up soon, so keep an eye out!! |
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JB
Mr Quoter-vator
Joined: 16 Feb 2004
Posts: 7405
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Sun Jan 09, 2005 7:13 am |
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the dizzy assy fits quite snug in that bore, i fear for oil leakage....i do have access to a milling machine as i said before but its a risk...but hey u got 2 ehads now  i cud try for you...so long as it was totally non-coming-back-on-me-able...lol
that btm end is gunna go for a good amount....its been rising steadily
i must come and see that meg engine before u fit/take apart.... |
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stan
Gay Rights Activist
Joined: 07 Apr 2004
Posts: 1268
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Sun Jan 09, 2005 7:46 am |
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well this is my major fear at the moment.....splash out on getting the bigger valves fitetd, then find the dizzy fitment isnt sound. SO, i dont know whether to build it as "standard" first to make sure its ok, and then fit the valves==pain in the arse swapping heads...OR go ahead with the valves now.
Like i said, the pressure in the head is minimal, so providing i get it "close enough", sealer can be used to give a proper seal. i may take it to the machine shop in uni and see what they can do.
Youve seen it JB, do you reckon it could be done at your place?? of course it wont come back on you!!
pop round one night this week if u want... |
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JB
Mr Quoter-vator
Joined: 16 Feb 2004
Posts: 7405
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Sun Jan 09, 2005 1:14 pm |
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tbh it would be a big task as the miller we have only has a normal sized machine vice and thats no use...would have to clamp the head on its end which wouldnt be very secure either....id rather not mate lol BUT having said that it is just a matter of work-holding, if i could secure it enough i got the tools to do the cutting.
also, r u sure 34.6's can be fitted? i think benr said he has done it but lookin at my head the pitch of the valves seems to be 34mm only, which to me says they would clash with each other! |
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Neal
Forum Moderator
Joined: 18 Feb 2004
Posts: 7432
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Sun Jan 09, 2005 1:19 pm |
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clamp the work flat to the bed itself and turn the mill's head horizontal? |
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Chris H
Forum Moderator
Joined: 02 Mar 2004
Posts: 19978
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Sun Jan 09, 2005 1:20 pm |
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JB
Mr Quoter-vator
Joined: 16 Feb 2004
Posts: 7405
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Sun Jan 09, 2005 1:26 pm |
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possible neal...its a big old head tho not sure...but for the sake of experimentation i wouldnt like to be responsible,
right...i shall make a more accurate measurement...i aint sayin they dont fit but for my own satisfaction i want to measure...
they must be at least practically touching each other! |
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Chris H
Forum Moderator
Joined: 02 Mar 2004
Posts: 19978
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Sun Jan 09, 2005 1:31 pm |
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they can run very close, they don't grow much unlike the exhausts. |
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stan
Gay Rights Activist
Joined: 07 Apr 2004
Posts: 1268
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Sun Jan 09, 2005 2:51 pm |
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I totally understand JB! not that i would blame you if you fooked me head up!! i'll take it to uni, see what the boys in the machine shop say.... |
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JB
Mr Quoter-vator
Joined: 16 Feb 2004
Posts: 7405
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Mon Jan 10, 2005 4:28 am |
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the only thing i got to do it with is a boring bar...looks like a trepanner...but im not sure how well it would work on only half a hole as is the case on this head. ideally it needs to be machining all the time...hopfully uni will have some better kit. |
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stan
Gay Rights Activist
Joined: 07 Apr 2004
Posts: 1268
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 8:44 am |
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Right, had the head machined to accept the dizzy, got it back today.....very pleased as it means i can definately use this head now!
will try and post pics today, but need batteries for my camera first! |
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stan
Gay Rights Activist
Joined: 07 Apr 2004
Posts: 1268
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 10:44 am |
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right! as Chris just pointed out...yes it is a bit mucky! thats where the parts washer comes in handy!
These pics ^^^ show (just!) the machining that has been carried out. a boring machine was used to take the opening to 42.4mm from around 30mm. the dizzy boss no sits nice and snug.
^^This is where the ISCV sits. unlike the clio it uses the manifold casting to divert air round the butterfly. The plan is to blank it off and...
Use this entry point which originally connects to the cam cover vent, to connect the 1.8 ISCV to. It goes through the casting to behind the butterfly. I reckon some material will need removing to allow sufficient air to pass, but that aint a problem
^^This is where the EGR valve sits (top of pic)...needless to say it is also getting blanked off.
I am now just waiting for my 34.6mm inlet valves to arrive, and i can then take the head to the machine shop to get new seats fitted. |
Last edited by stan on Sat Feb 26, 2005 11:43 am; edited 6 times in total |
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jimbo
Level 7 User
Joined: 27 Feb 2004
Posts: 243
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 10:49 am |
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JB
Mr Quoter-vator
Joined: 16 Feb 2004
Posts: 7405
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 11:31 am |
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nice pics! did work then |
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stan
Gay Rights Activist
Joined: 07 Apr 2004
Posts: 1268
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 11:35 am |
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yup.....looks more dirty than i thought!
i really need to make that workbench aswell...! |
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stan
Gay Rights Activist
Joined: 07 Apr 2004
Posts: 1268
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Sun Mar 06, 2005 5:08 am |
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Right...just a quick update:
Bottom end now rebuilt...new rings/shells etc, just the usual. Just waiting on alternator/pas steering bracket and pump from my other clio (16v converted RT, soon(ish) to be 16v turbo!), then i fully complete bottom end.
The head is at the machine shop at the moment having the larger valve seats pressed in and cut. will hopefully have that back within the next few days.
Pics of head/valves etc and complete bottom end will be up very soon! |
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stan
Gay Rights Activist
Joined: 07 Apr 2004
Posts: 1268
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Thu Mar 17, 2005 11:21 am |
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Chris H
Forum Moderator
Joined: 02 Mar 2004
Posts: 19978
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Thu Mar 17, 2005 11:30 am |
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thats the game.
Were the guides replaced? |
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stan
Gay Rights Activist
Joined: 07 Apr 2004
Posts: 1268
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Thu Mar 17, 2005 11:42 am |
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no. there wasnt any need..... |
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JB
Mr Quoter-vator
Joined: 16 Feb 2004
Posts: 7405
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Thu Mar 17, 2005 1:34 pm |
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just been to see it...pucker i tell you. |
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jimbo
Level 7 User
Joined: 27 Feb 2004
Posts: 243
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Sat Mar 19, 2005 8:22 am |
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that is mint.
what have u done to the inlet man to improve flow matey?
jimbo |
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